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Mike Breen: Why The Missional Movement Will Fail – Part 2

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  • Len Hjalmarson

    Mike, nice to see a followup – not so nice to see in in grey scale. Any chance you can change this font to pure black – some of us over fifty are getting eye-strain  :)

    • http://twitter.com/VergeNetwork Verge Network

      Thanks for the input, Len. Let’s see if we can’t push the grey scale up a little bit…  :-)

      • Rupert Lewis

        I know I m late on this article but just a quick point dont mission and discipleship go hand in hand? It not one then the other but both together. We cannot truly be a disciple if we dont go on  mission and mission leads to us becoming a disciple. This is not to discount that at times we do need a place of rest healing and recooperation. But as the first commentor inferred the key is not so much in methodology as in staying close to Jesus walking daily in obedience to Him. Like Jesus walk on earth there our times to ne out there on mission and other times to come away with the few and rest with God

        • Mike Breen

          Rupert, I think that’s exactly the point. If you separate mission from discipleship, and vice versa, it stops being the thing it purports to be. That’s why I used the analogy of the cheeseburger with no cheese. It’s completely non-semsical. They are inseparable.

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  • Keith

    is there a way to make the content of the workshop available online afterwards for those of us who aren’t going to make it to SC (because we live in WA)?

    btw – thank you for these two posts. you’ve provided answers to questions i’ve been wrestling with.

  • http://www.future-shape-of-church.org/ Edward Green

    From an Anglo-Catholic perspective I think you are spot on Mike. Especially the chart.

  • Mark Champion

    Very interesting. Doing what Jesus asked us to do… I read the first article and the first three paragraphs. I was excited! However, when the answer was discipleship, I realized this is another article to take our focus off of Christ and on to doing what we can do to attain some level of spiritual actualization over time. I can’t get down with discipleship and missional living. These are two distractions from our great Lord, Jesus Christ! He is all! When we are in Christ, abiding in Him, the Vine, we are not responsible for bearing fruit. He bears fruit through us. When we do programs that lead us to man made goals of becoming like Christ, we will have results that resemble the author o the program. Leadership creates movements. That is what most people are looking for…movements to be a part of. What is our goal was to be in Christ and to express Him as a part of Hos body? That could change the way we see doing discipleship or missional living. It could reveal a way of being that would show Christ.

    Thanks for writing what is on your heart. It was encouraging to read. I pray God’s will would be revealed to each reader as their pursuit of Christ is their motivation! He is beautiful!

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  • Gilbert Quarcoopome

    I think that the arguments are very solid. It’s about time we changed our attitude and thinking to discipleship and missions. It’s unfortunate that the church today is concentrating on building the church with structures and programs rather than discipleship. Discipleship indeed is our core function as Christians as Jesus commanded us to go and make disciples because we have been with Him. How can a people who have not known him and experienced him and have not learnt from Him go and make disciples. You cannot give what you don’t have. The word of God says that; ” freely ye have received, freely ye must give”. My emphasis is on the RECEIVE. What have you received that you are going to give out. As a matter of fact discipleship is the hall mark of any missions and if it is neglected indeed it will be an exercise in frutility.

  • David M Gustafson

    In regards to parts 1 & 2, they read to me like a dissection of discipleship and missional life when they ought not be separated.  While part 2 corrects this by speaking of imbalance, it nonetheless presents a weak view of missionality or is pointing to weak examples of missional churches.

  • Mike J

    I agree whole-heartedly.

    In the early 90s I found myself church planting. My desire
    was to plant a church that was not permission withholding, constricting and
    territorial, but rather one that was permission giving, sharing responsibility
    and authority. It was the year Field of Dreams was released. I imagined
    planting a church– “building it and they would come.” I dreamed of bringing
    those who were unchurched into a body of people who accepted them, celebrated together
    and gave them permission to serve their second week at worship if they felt led
    by God.  I was also following the lead of
    celebrity authors of the day who were arguing for unleashing the laity. How
    would these new leaders grow as disciples? I assumed that serving with and
    rubbing shoulders with “us” would grow them as we shared ministry and service
    together.

     

    I was wrong. Far too often, unresolved deep pains in
    people’s lives (including my own) raised their ugly head at some point, causing
    confusing actions that left the body in vibration with anxiety.

    Serving this broken world missionally and growing in Christ just go hand-in-hand on this journey!

  • Graham

    Great article, very challenging and very helpful for my context. My question is this: when it comes to growing competancies in disciples that reflect the competencies of Jesus, does this mean the goal is for each individual disciple to have ALL the competencies of Jesus or does it mean that all together as disciples our competencies will combine so that we will possess all of the competencies of Jesus? How does the answer to this question factor into how we develop competencies in individual disciples? Thanks!

  • http://www.radiantworship.com Richy Clark

    So if you’re intelligent enough, “high competency” and have excellent character, then you get “unlimited kingdom breakthrough…?”  I don’t think this was the case with Peter in Acts 2.  I’m thankful God didn’t hold him to that! 

    Discipleship is huge.  But the whole premise in your article just comes across as arrogant.  Would of been nice to hear what the mission movement needs.. as opposed to giving it a death sentence.  Kinda left these two articles bummed. 

  • Danny

    I read your “Part 1″ a couple of months ago and just ran across 2. Personally, I think Part 1 is more on target than 2, simply because of the definition of Competency.

    Besides that, they are both really good and define an ongoing struggle on the streets of the enemy.

  • Graham Carter

    Thx a lot for this Mike. Yes and amen to what you are saying. I’ve been a cross-cultural missionary for many years and our focus has always been on discipleship the way you describe it. We went into the South Pacific Islands to plant Christian radio and soon realized people were already talking a lot about God, but badly misrepresenting Him. Planting Christian radio would only exacerbate this problem.
    So we began discipling local youth into a personal relationship with Jesus and allowing some of them to share their journey of discovery as they grew as followers of Jesus Christ.This led to an increasing hunger in our radio listeners and to opportunities to plant many home fellowships based on our local language Radio Bible School in the evenings, plus discussion, prayer and application of what’s being learned into village life.We continually hear stories of people finding new ways to serve Jesus in their communities and finding new Radio Bible School groups that have been planted by other groups or individual radio listeners. Ie: missional as a result of discipleship!
    re Character and Competency.
    We are proactive in Bible training for character (our Radio Bible School) and mostly reactive with training for competency. People learn better as they encounter challenges to their serving Christ. Our coaching style helps guide them seek the answers they need from the Lord via His Word and prayer. This way the Lord is seen as the authority in the disciple’s life and ministry.

    True discipleship (coaching apprenticeships) will always lead to a culture or ethos that extends God’s Kingdom. 

  • http://journalmissionalliving.wordpress.com/ Sharon R Hoover

    Your “clue/clause” description so perfectly illustrates the tension. I believe part of the reason we are on this slippery slope is because of our Western tendencies to measure everything. The metrics we are asked to share at times become the goal … numbers baptized, Sunday morning numbers, teens in our youth ministries, budgets, etc etc etc. “Disciples” are tough to measure so we look at the metrics as reported by church members: time in the Word weekly, leadership offices, # of times to church in a month, etc etc. I do also know that we need to have some guidelines, measurable guidelines. But we also do want disciples with character, competence and faith. I don’t have the solution to this paradox. But then… maybe we’re all overanalyzing!

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